Dan Kane's Rivets Q40 - Making Male Molds

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DonStegall
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Dan Kane's Rivets Q40 - Making Male Molds

Postby DonStegall » Tue Dec 26, 2017 7:13 am

Dan Kane carved a plug for the Rivets sometime in the 90's. According to Dan, not a lot were built. In the 2000's I ended up with the molds. I believe Jim Gager had them before I got them. I produced a couple, but never did new wing core templates for them. I have kept them stored in climate controlled conditions since I got them.

Dan contacted me about getting molds back or me making a couple of fuselages for him. I use WEST epoxy and he is not a fan of that epoxy. So the molds are being shipped back to Dan. I'm late on getting them back to him. The main reason is I wanted to make male molds in case something happens to the originals. Countless molds have been lost in transportation, shop accidents, house fires, parts sticking.

When I make a set of molds or acquire them, I usually make male molds. This has worked out very well. I sent the Smasher Q500 molds to Kevin Matney and he produces Smasher fuselages for me. But I have my male molds just waiting to be sanded, compounded, and polished to make more molds.

I always use PartAll PVA. Partall Film #10 is a water and alcohol based polyvinyl alcohol (PVA) coating comprised of water soluble, film forming materials. It is excellent for releasing epoxies, polyesters, and urethanes. Recommended application procedure is apply wax, then PVA Mold Release then wax again. I do not try to wax after the application of the PVA because I have found it too easy to damage the PVA.

I had prepared the molds earlier, and I got the PVAa sprayed on. The goal is to finish the male molds no later than this coming weekend and get them shipped off.

Greg Doe has produced some molds that I have now. He did canopy molds for the Sky Raider Mach II and the LA Racer 40 ARF kits. He did a belly pan mold for the Estrellita/Shark EF1. I'm making male molds of these so I can send them back and also make as many sets of molds as I need.

If anyone wants fiberglass belly pans for the Estrellita/Shark EF1, just contact me. The rest of the molds for that plane are in progress. Hope to have them done by early to mid February
Attachments
IMG_2327.jpg
This is the belly pan for the Rivets
IMG_2328.jpg
You can see the green tint on the molds.
IMG_2329.jpg
IMG_2326.jpg
These are molds for some Club 40 planes and an Estrellita Belly pan.
IMG_2325.jpg
I keep my nozzle from getting clogged using the technique that SATA uses. The bucket is completely full and the nozzle is submerged.
Last edited by DonStegall on Mon Jan 01, 2018 10:28 am, edited 1 time in total.


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Re: Dan Kane's Rivets - Making Male Molds

Postby DonStegall » Wed Dec 27, 2017 1:38 pm

I got up well before dawn and started making a video on making the male molds.
Attachments
IMG_2330.JPG
These are some Club 40 canopy parts plus a LA Racer 40 cowl mold and and Estrellita/Shark EF1 belly pan
IMG_2331.JPG
These are Estrellita/Shark EF1 wheel pants. I had more surface coat than I needed. I waxed these a couple of times and went for it. No PVA so they may stick. Or I may have to melt the white plastic off.
IMG_2332.JPG
The Rivets belly pan and a Estrellita/Shark EF1 turtle deck
IMG_2333.JPG
One side of the Rivets. Didn't take a picture of the other half, but it looks good. With penty of waxing, plus PVA, I'm not worried about these getting stuck.


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Re: Dan Kane's Rivets - Making Male Molds

Postby DonStegall » Fri Dec 29, 2017 10:20 am

The first layers of cloth are on the Rivets fuselage and belly pan molds, and on the Estrellita/Shark EF1 Belly pan. All of this is being video taped, but will be edited down to a fairly short video.
Attachments
IMG_2338.JPG


vonderhey
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Re: Dan Kane's Rivets - Making Male Molds

Postby vonderhey » Fri Dec 29, 2017 1:07 pm

Just finished making a new Super Shark fuse mold myself.
Attachments
5EF6476F-8855-4CD0-ABB9-4AE43271C064.jpeg
Finished plug
B785CBDE-4A73-4FE9-BC36-7AA8A023B4E8.jpeg
Mold process
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Re: Dan Kane's Rivets - Making Male Molds

Postby DonStegall » Fri Dec 29, 2017 1:41 pm

Lee,

Great looking plane.

Can you show detail and describe the technique on how you do the fasteners embedded on the parting plate?

Do you do tooling dough or cloth lay-up's on the molds? I tried the tooling dough on a small part once, but it was a challenge to mix. I've heard that a KitchenAid or similar mixer works well for the dough.

I make my molds thick and have just been tapping them for 1/4-20, but using an electric screw driver wears them out. You have to be careful of cross-threading even if you do them by hand. I have used 10-32, but that is just too small. 10-24 might work.

I asked the Q40 approval committee to change the name of the Shark that Jerry Small did and I bought the molds for and the name change was approved. The new name is Mako Shark Q40. Mako Shark is what the Anequim word means in Brazilian where the full scale plane was designed and flown to records. This was to avoid confusion with the Mace Shark. I had seen that there was a Shark on the Q40 approved list. I seem to remember it having your name on it.

I'm working on molds for the Estrellita / Shark EF1 at the same time. About half way there. Should have everything but the cowl done by the end of next weekend. Shooting for having all of the EF1 molds done by early February. If I ever get the EF1 kits into production under my label, I will probably have the name changed to Mace Shark EF1.

Are you doing new wing molds for the Super Shark Q40 and are they going to be from plugs or CNC cut? Do you mind sharing what airfoil you are using?

I'm looking forward to seeing one of your planes in RTF or near RTF form. If you have pictures of the original, I would like to see those. You could post here or email them to don.f.stegall@gmail.com


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Re: Dan Kane's Rivets - Making Male Molds

Postby vonderhey » Fri Dec 29, 2017 2:28 pm

05741DA7-7D95-48A9-88F5-81A1BADCBA5E.jpeg
First new fuse out of the mold.


vonderhey
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Re: Dan Kane's Rivets - Making Male Molds

Postby vonderhey » Fri Dec 29, 2017 2:37 pm

Don, with all do respect Sir I am not interested in posting the details of constructing the plug / molds and the technical info involved with the whole process. Please understand that I’m not being secretive, I’m just very tired of people looking at what I do and then say “ well So & So does it this way”. So let’s get “ So & So “ to post how it’s done. Von Der Hey.


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Re: Dan Kane's Rivets - Making Male Molds

Postby DonStegall » Fri Dec 29, 2017 7:30 pm

Lee,

I know I'm not one of your favorite people. Unfortunately I did not make the OJA Champ race because my 94 year old Aunt Madeline passed away on the Thursday before. I had planned to come and video tape a lot of the race from on the course with my GoPro on my helmet. I hope to get to meet you one of these days. I know you are one of the more technical people out there and we may even have some stories to swap.

When I see something that looks good, I inquire about the techniques. I almost always credit people from whom I have learned.

I'm doing videos on http://RCPylon.TV and http://DonStegall.com. I want to add videos from other people. I can edit raw video and smooth things up. It can even be video recorded on a phone.

Talking on the phone is a lot easier than typing for most people. I was at the at the hospital getting my every 4 week double dose Remicade IV infusion in the chemo department for my Crohn's Disease ($42K+ each time) earlier in the day from 12:01 pm to 4:00 pm. I worked on an article for Model Aviation to promote sport racing at the 2018 NATS and beyond while I was getting my drugs. It may or may not get published somewhere, but I like writing.

My phone number is 704-968-2881 and I'm usually available from 8 am to 8 pm every day. I do have meetings at Bank of America where I am a contract software engineer. But I often get a lot of communicating done during my 1 hour commute to work and one and half hour commute home hands free in my car on the days I work in the office. And when I'm at home working, I limit how much time I spend away from my work computer. Bank of America has most sites blocked, but I still see incoming stuff on my phone to answer at an appropriate time.

My email is Don.F.Stegall@gmail.com ... Would love to see some of your designs in photos ... Feel free to send large email attachments and I can give you my Google Drive and DropBox locations or create a private one for you.


ronin4740
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Re: Dan Kane's Rivets - Making Male Molds

Postby ronin4740 » Sat Dec 30, 2017 3:37 pm

..


vonderhey
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Re: Dan Kane's Rivets - Making Male Molds

Postby vonderhey » Sun Dec 31, 2017 12:44 pm

I'm just not interested Don.


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Re: Dan Kane's Rivets - Making Male Molds

Postby DonStegall » Sun Dec 31, 2017 12:49 pm

vonderhey wrote:I'm just not interested Don.


No problem Lee. Just let me know if you ever change your mind.
Last edited by DonStegall on Sun Dec 31, 2017 1:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.


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Re: Dan Kane's Rivets - Making Male Molds

Postby DonStegall » Sun Dec 31, 2017 12:53 pm

As the readers of this thread know, I'm in the process of making male molds for the Rivets Q40 done by Dan Kane Jr. I'm also working on making male molds for some Club 40 canopies and a cowl. Greg Doe made the original Club 40 molds. I'm also make male and female molds for the Estrellita EF1 / Shark EF1.

This is an intro to a video that will be about the whole process. https://youtu.be/KY4LO0eesOQ

I want to thank Jim Katz, Dan Kane, Kevin Matney, Greg Doe, my father Jim Stegall, and many others for the knowledge sharing and inspiration for my modeling and other life activities.



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Re: Dan Kane's Rivets Q40 - Making Male Molds

Postby DonStegall » Tue Jan 02, 2018 12:29 pm

I video recorded the demolding of the male molds for Rivets Q40 belly pan and the Estrellita EF1 / Shark EF1 belly pan. It will be pretty short as it wasn't a lot of work to get the male molds out. I was a little concerned about the Rivets because of the negative angle at the back of the pan. But it turned out to be easier than taking an actual part out once I got the flanges free. Here are pictures of the male molds and the originals that don't seem to have been damaged at all.

I should have the Rivets fuselage done by the end of the weekend.

The EF1 parts except for the cowl should either have male or female molds (depending on which part I'm working) by the end of next weekend. My goal is to have a complete set of female molds plus the hatch canopy mold by the end of the month I'm doing the hatch in both fiberglass and molded plastic so one can have their pick of all plastic, all fiberglass, or fiberglass with a clear canopy inserted.
Attachments
IMG_2347.JPG
the male and female molds
IMG_2348.JPG
the female Rivets belly pan
IMG_2349.JPG
the male Rivets belly pan
IMG_2351.JPG
the female Estrellita belly pan
IMG_2352.JPG
the male Estrellita belly pan


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DonStegall
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Re: Dan Kane's Rivets Q40 - Making Male Molds

Postby DonStegall » Sat Jan 06, 2018 3:48 pm

IMG_2353.jpg

This is the Estrellita / Shark belly pan male mold after a quick trim and washing the PVA off

I did not get to put any glass on the molds after Monday due to work and a migraine headache one day.

Today I have put the final layers of the light cloth on the Rivets fuselage molds, the Club 40 canopy molds, and two more pieces for the Estrellita


IMG_2354.jpg

This is the Rivets belly pan male mold after a quick trim and washing the PVA off

If the fuselage molds come out this good I will be extremely happy.

I'm starting the 5.8 ounce cloth tonight. I hope to finish the layups on Sunday and pop them out on Tuesday.


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Re: Dan Kane's Rivets Q40 - Making Male Molds

Postby DonStegall » Mon Jan 08, 2018 11:23 am

IMG_2358.JPG

This is the turtle deck male molds for the Estrellita EF1 / Shark EF1. The areas at the fin fillets were very sharp. Either I did not get enough surface coat on those areas, or I broke some small pieces off while tearing off the thin plastic original turtle deck. These will be easy repairs. The hardest part will be sanding the "plug" and getting it smooth before making the female mold(s).


IMG_2357.JPG

This is the part that the two wing fillets come out of. I also did not get enough surface coat in some of the sharp areas. I will make a mle molds then I will made new molds for each half that are fitted to the wing and do not have an open area on the bottom of the fillet


IMG_2359.JPG

This is the male mold made from the LA Racer 40 mold made by Greg Doe. Now I can make more females and produce as many as needed. I may make a plug for pulling clear plastic canopies in plastic that doesn't yellow like TWM canopies do.


IMG_2356.JPG

This is the male mold for the Sky Raider Mach II Club 40 plane. After making a few female molds, I may try making some clear plastic canopies.


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