Tavares Invitational Updates

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KRProton
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Re: Tavares Invitational Updates

Postby KRProton » Thu Jan 18, 2018 10:45 am

Definitely a work in process and I hope I'm not infringing on anybody's authority here...just tinkering.

Okay, with the revelation that the Google Earth image of the LARKS site is one with the older runway that is shorter, the site just got smaller when I scale it down for the smaller runway. I switched to Ray's image, but it, too had to be scaled accordingly. In the interest of scaling the site correctly in both directions, I found the dimensions of the runway on the LARKS site where it says 500' x 45' runway. I don't know how accurate that is, so take the new, scaled image with a grain of salt. But with the site relatively "shrinking" to the size of the course, it makes things even tighter.

First, I re drew a "flip-flopable" takeoff pad with the dimensions shown (came out to what Hank suggested for lane width). If it is desired to be able to flip-flop the course about the start line on the takeoff pad, the pad then needs to be both twice as long and twice as wide as needed for only a single course. So a reasonable 30' long x 50' wide takeoff pad grows to 60' x 100' to use it for both courses.

Okay, when I impose just the single, blue course over the site, I have balance the distance to walk from the course to the edge of the runway with the amount of pits taken up by the required set-back. The more pits the farther the walk to the runway and vice-versa. to slide it pretty far left to keep some of the pits South of the pavallion available.

It gets worse when I impose both courses over the site. To accommodate the 300' set-back at pylon 1 for the white course (to keep the roadway open), the whole thing needs to be shifted even farther left (West).

It would be helpful to get another areal view of the site from directly overhead the runway as high as possible. And also get accurate dimensions of the runway (maybe the measurements on the web site are accurate?).

Tim
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Takeoff pad.jpg
LARKS layout 7b.jpg
LARKS layout 7a.jpg


KRProton
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Re: Tavares Invitational Updates

Postby KRProton » Thu Jan 18, 2018 11:28 am

Were another areal shot to be taken, it would be helpful if the runway was horizontal in the image (as in Ray's image below), and the image was from directly over the runway for minimal distortion. It would be good to get enough altitude to include the entire parameter of the road in the shot.

Additionally, proivde measurements between two horizontal points and two vertical points indentifyable in the new image (such as runway length and the distances between one of the vent pipes and the edge of the runway).

Next-best scenario is to forgoe the new imge, but still get the dimensions requested above so I can apply to Ray's image for the best scaleing.

Tim
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LARKS dimensions.jpg

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airplanescotty
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Re: Tavares Invitational Updates

Postby airplanescotty » Fri Jan 19, 2018 10:15 am

Tim,,

Yes,,, we need to get some reality to your Tinkering, which is greatly is greatly appreciated by the way :P :P,,,

Greg and I are going to try to get some measurements this weekend!

I also agree that all that is need is two reference points and we can extrapolate from there!!! :-? :-?

Stand By !!! :roll: :cry: :roll:

XXOO

Scotty
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Re: Tavares Invitational Updates

Postby fizzwater2 » Fri Jan 19, 2018 10:52 am

Do you have lat/lon coordinates for the field?
Out of all the places we could be, this is one of them.


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Re: Tavares Invitational Updates

Postby Hanknsd » Fri Jan 19, 2018 11:16 am

Tim,
The launch pad can be half that width if you are able to offset either course.
The depth of the pad can also be smaller if you move the pilots positions closer to the edge for each pad.
Hope that makes sense.
Hank D


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Re: Tavares Invitational Updates

Postby KRProton » Fri Jan 19, 2018 5:40 pm

fizzwater2 wrote:Do you have lat/lon coordinates for the field?


Hi Gordon - thanks.

28°45'19.3"N latitude, 81°44'26.9"W longitude

Tim


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Re: Tavares Invitational Updates

Postby KRProton » Fri Jan 19, 2018 5:47 pm

airplanescotty wrote:Tim,,

Yes,,, we need to get some reality to your Tinkering, which is greatly is greatly appreciated by the way :P :P,,,

Greg and I are going to try to get some measurements this weekend!

I also agree that all that is need is two reference points and we can extrapolate from there!!! :-? :-?

Stand By !!! :roll: :cry: :roll:

XXOO

Scotty


Scaleing the field corrrectly wouldn't be so important, but in this case we are really trying to squeeze in the course and the required set-back separation given certain criteria such as adequate pits area, not having to close the drive, proximity to the runway, etc. It's a pretty expansive site, but it shrinks down quickly when you try to fit in a pylon course given the restrictions, so having actual X & Y measurements will help me scale Ray's image as best as I can so we can finalize a workable layout.

Tim


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Re: Tavares Invitational Updates

Postby KRProton » Fri Jan 19, 2018 5:52 pm

Hanknsd wrote:Tim,
The launch pad can be half that width if you are able to offset either course.
The depth of the pad can also be smaller if you move the pilots positions closer to the edge for each pad.
Hope that makes sense.
Hank D


Hi Hank.

If the course could flip-flopped about the starting line (thus requiring a takeoff pad twice the length actually necessary - as I have drawn it) that would negate having to move the starting line officials and all that equipment. But on the other hand, the likelihood of having to flip the course once it's settled on is probably small. Plus, I guess having to move the start line officials/timers over a few feet probably isn't that big of a deal. I don't know how difficult it is to put down that geotextile runway material and I don't know how much they have, so maybe size is of no importance. I can take that up with Scotty when we draw out a final takeoff pad. Thanks for the suggestion.

Tim

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airplanescotty
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Re: Tavares Invitational Updates

Postby airplanescotty » Sat Jan 20, 2018 9:48 am

After a couple of years at this field, I cannot remember landing from the west and into the wind. Typically our winds are out of the North or North West so X-wind or X-wind/Down wind!

Sunday race day was typical Winds :P

Tomorrow we will put tape to dirt and see what we get :o :roll: :lol:
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Re: Tavares Invitational Updates

Postby fizzwater2 » Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:35 am

I don't have it here at home, but with Google Earth you can get overhead views, and the measuring tool is pretty darned good. Use it at work all the time
Out of all the places we could be, this is one of them.


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Re: Tavares Invitational Updates

Postby rocket » Sun Jan 21, 2018 8:36 am

That's where I got the pic but the screen shot didn't capture the legend. Hmmm
And I said, here am I send me.


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Re: Tavares Invitational Updates

Postby gmc » Sun Jan 21, 2018 9:54 am

Runway with both X's pictured is 495' x 42.6'...
Previous length was 200' shorter.

Wind briskly from NE today.... Plus I have pics of Scotty landing from the West....lol.... So orientation may be more flexible.
(They say memory is the second thing to go.... Lol)

Waiting on Scotty to get out here, but see several options with pylon 3 at or 50' east of the NW runway corner.
That corner is 328' from nearest point of pavillion... So we keep that and our normal parking usable...

More to come... And THANKS for all the input!!


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Re: Tavares Invitational Updates

Postby KRProton » Sun Jan 21, 2018 10:59 am

gmc wrote:Runway with both X's pictured is 495' x 42.6'...
Previous length was 200' shorter.

Wind briskly from NE today.... Plus I have pics of Scotty landing from the West....lol.... So orientation may be more flexible.
(They say memory is the second thing to go.... Lol)

Waiting on Scotty to get out here, but see several options with pylon 3 at or 50' east of the NW runway corner.
That corner is 328' from nearest point of pavillion... So we keep that and our normal parking usable...

More to come... And THANKS for all the input!!


I've re scaled Ray's image for a 42.6' x 495' runway per your dimensions provided above.

Based upon your description (Scotty landing from West, pylon 3 near NW corner of runway), looks like the course orientation you're suggesting is depicted below. According to my measurement, the closest corner of the pavilion is 314' to the NW corner of the runway, but that could be off just because of the imprecision of scaleing and taking measurements off the image - in other words I think the drawing is somewhat scale enough for planning, but I'd go by your measurements.

Well, that's my stab at the course and takeoff pad layout at this moment.

Tim
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LARKS 8.jpg

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Re: Tavares Invitational Updates

Postby airplanescotty » Sun Jan 21, 2018 7:09 pm

Given club wishes and Lake County directives, coupled with the requirements is keeping the sun to our workers back we will present to the club a new take off area be established that is very similar to your last layout!

After Greg & I bounced sround out there we got real Comfy how we will set the course for next year!

Oh,, based on all the worker input, club officers input,, I can not imagine us not hosting a race next year!!! Plus the Scouts committed to next year already :P

In addition,,, we are leaning real hard to keeping the Jan date,,, logic being ,,, no way another we will get another Cold Jan weekend !

Club meeting This Thursday,,, I will post the decision!

XXOO Scotty
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Re: Tavares Invitational Updates

Postby airplanescotty » Fri Jan 26, 2018 8:21 am

The LARKS Club, last night, voted to host "Race #2"!!!!!

The club will reconfigure the course to include a new Take Off Pad,,,, enabling the use of the Pavilion, parking, and porta potty's, which will position the sun at the Judges back so they can better see the planes ! :P :roll: :wink: :o

It docent get any better :D :lol: :wink:

Finally, the club also approved my submitting a "Bid" to host the World Trials,, later this year!

Stay Tuned!!!

Scotty
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